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Player feedback from June 2021
Dungeoneers
May 31, 2021 19:32

This topic contains player feedback for this month that the player approved for the forum.

May 31, 2021 19:32

Ok People;

To days daily hunt states: “Hunting RATS in the Lost Temple”

REALLY???????

So for I have been through at least a Dozen levels/boards of the “Temple”;

Yet in ALL of the encounters; I have encountered LESS than 5% of ALL the monsters have been “RATS”!1

I Hell I have encountered TEN TIMES that amount in GHOULS, GHOSTS, and ZOMBIES, and that is NOT counting the Other Monsters!

If You are going to call this a “DAILY HUNT” for a PARTICULAR MONSTER, THE by DAMNED the Monster SHOULD Constitute at the VERY LEAST 90% of the Monsters!

Otherwise You are turning this “Daily Hunt” into a absolute JOKE!

Jun 1, 2021 7:52

The game has improved so much since 2011. You all are so talented! I still have my Ron Paul figurine…lol I wonder if I’m the oldest Dungeoneer still around? Thanks for advancing me. It’s been a while but I’m having fun with it :)

Jun 1, 2021 12:05

Today’s Daily Hunt States: “HUNT GHOULS”

I have just been through 10 of the “Misty Bluffs” Board.

I have encountered JUST THREE GHOULS TOTAL!!!!

GET REAL PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jun 1, 2021 12:41

Not gone through many hunts, but so far: The first few floors contain very little of the desired monster. You might consider sneaking through the room. The middle floors are alright. The floors after around 40 loot start spawning so many enemies with defence >5, that swordsman becomes utterly useless.

Jun 1, 2021 13:48

@krayonc - it’s all set to get more cool new stuff in the next release too, with different routes to the different dragon lairs!

@Lasermancer - all that is by design. There are more of the region monsters and less of the prey monsters at the beginning of the hunt. And the monsters get bigger as well as you proceed. The weapons you get are adjusted both for the region and for the prey, but yes it gets harder the further you go.

Jun 3, 2021 7:17

oversized creatures like dragons and overgrown magic mushroom man can easily obstruct the terrain and loot in maps. I had an overgrown magic spell caster and its staff hide what kind of item is on an item rack. Instead of oversizing the creatures, why not give them magical auras to visually identify their additional strength? Also note, dragons can soemtimes make it hard to see where the mithril vest is located

Jun 3, 2021 10:48

Worst oversized creatures are the Ettins. They can completely block the tiles behind them from player observation when sufficiently large. However loot is easier to locate (not a problem in daily hunts, obviously) when you look at the list of things on the side. If you move the cursor over the loot, such as the vest, the list highlights the listed item (vest, weapon rack, chest, scroll, monster of certain type…) it’s sometimes the only way to find out that there are pits on some tiles that are completely invisible behind monsters. Let’s hope that we’ll get the promised visual option of showing every monster at normal size so the floor can be seen behind the creatures.

Jun 3, 2021 14:38

Ok, so I still could not figure out the sequence of enemy turns. I understand that casters go first, then archers, a worm, then melees, but what determines the order inside a group. I noticed that the order changes sometimes, for example, if you have and enemy and a reaper and the reaper’s turn is after the enemy, sometimes they can swap and the reaper will kill the enemy. Why does it happen? Is it pure random? It does happen to other monsters as well.

I like how it is implemented in the game that you can hover your mouse pointer over a monster and see the probability to hit it. It would be nice to get a reverse option also, namely, you hover over a monster while holding Ctrl, or Shift, or whatever key you like, and see the probability this monster will hit you in the next round without defense is applied. You can do all this calculation manually but who wants to waste time?

Since the dwarf has an ability to summon a worm, I thought it could be cool if there is an ability of the Elf “Dark ritual” when she sacrifices 1 hp and summons a reaper to any free tile of the battle field. As always, the reaper seeks to kill the elf, so it is your business to kite him properly. It should not work in dragon lair for sure. What do you think?

Jun 3, 2021 18:44

tandu, the problem with the list on right side of screen only list 5 random categories of things in the room. therefore, you cannot always get a complete picture of what is in the room, in actual reality. It still doesn’t help the fact the weapon racks could either be a sword, shield, or bow and the list doesn’t tell you which item is on display (esp if visually obstructed by some monster).

Maybe vitaly, what we should propose is a hardcore game mode, where evil Summoners can summon reapers in the ruins. Example: evil summoner has 3 Hp, and each time it successfully summons a reaper, it loses 1 hp. And to make things even more interesting, make it so that fires destroys loot on the ground :D

Jun 4, 2021 9:21

The list shows 5 things but the categories are not random. I believe casters have a higher priority than ranged enemies but both categories are among those usually displayed. Melee enemies is a much lower priority and very wide pits are at the bottom of the list (meaning they are most often left out if there’s more than 5 things to list). I don’t know what the listed monster priority is, that could be random or not. Weapon racks or chests aren’t a high priority on the list. Of course the list doesn’t distinguish between different weapon types or chest types. So the list isn’t perfect but occasionally it has its’ uses. I still hope for a minimap that would show the same info that should be visible on the dungeon. Location of pits, monsters and loot. It could be opened on the screen, like the hero statistics page, but wouldn’t remain open as turns are played.

Jun 4, 2021 13:15

That’s a good hint to use the list on the right to highlight things behind Ettins. Oversized Ettins are definitely the worst. Check out Discord for some great screenshots of that (Rellik Nogard’s “As you can clearly see, I am absolutely safe on this side of the long deep rift through the middle of the battlefield” for example) . Other things that can help are hovering over hexes and looking at the top right, trying to put fire on a hex (you can always cancel) or look at the bottom left to see what type of action you’d be taking (more use with the elf). Roll on the button to make the monsters temporarily small!

The elf summoning the reaper is an interesting idea. The elf is really the only one that can guide the reaper. But, the elf is already a very strong hero if played well.

@VitalyKobolov - As you worked out, within the categories like casters, archers etc, which monster goes next is random, as is the path they will choose if there are two otherwise equal ones. So sometimes they will move favourably for you, and sometimes they won’t.

Jun 7, 2021 14:53

Hello, I propose this user interface change. For those players with advanced dungeoneering (the version with tunnels, mithril vest), Add an adventurer’s checklist that lets players keep track whether tunnels were completed. If you want to improve on the checklist, indicate how many caverns, mines and ruin rooms were completed as well.

Personally, I do not finish a game in one sitting, and I am prone to forgetting whether the tunnels are completed so I end up redoing them. One simple modification to User interface can solve that forgetful problem

Jun 7, 2021 21:04

Idea for Daily hunts: make the items you are collecting = to points that you can spend to “buy” better gear to start with instead of +1 gear like usual…catch is after you use the points they are only good for that adventure through the dungeons (I.E. if you are trying to kill 10 red dragons in your career or 15 dragons in tournament and so on) after you are done they disappear as usual after you win or die…+2 gear 200 pts…+3 gear 500 pts…+4 gear 1,000 pts…+5 gear 1,700 pts…+6 gear 2,400 pts…+7 gear 3,200 pts…+8 gear 4,200 pts and +9 gear 5,500 pts or maybe be able to buy at MAX 1 potion for 3,000 pts…just a very rough idea.

Jun 7, 2021 23:58

I think many would agree that the knight loses in power to both the elf and the dwarf, once he gets surrounded by crowds of enemies. The dwarf can hunker and kill everyone around with the frenzy skill, and the elf can leap jump to the other side of the battlefield, stunning and hitting all the enemies on the way. The knight can do nothing, as his most power (full swing) is off. In fact, I believe that the knight has one quite useless skill, which is PUNT. Indeed, if you are hit by a small creature, you are doing really really badly and probably nothing will save you anyway. I suggest that the punt skill should be either improved or replaced by something useful. For example, if the knight is surrounded by 3+ enemies and gets hit, he kicks any monster back to one tile. In my mind that would not be an OP skill, as there still will remain at lest 2 monsters nearby, so the full swing is not active yet, however it will give the knight a chance to survive.

Jun 8, 2021 8:16

I DO NOT BELIEVE FOR ONE DAMN SECOND THAT SOMEONE GOT 212 GAS SPORES ON TODAY’S DAILY HUNT!????

DID EVERY ATTACK THE THE MONSTERS MADE FAIL?!?!?!?!?!?

DID HE OR SHE PASS EVERY SAVE?!?!?!?!

DID HE OR SHE NEVER EVER MISS WHEN ATTACKING!?!?!?!?!

NO WAY IN HELL!!!!!

THEY ONLY WAY IS YOUR PEOPLE TO DELIBERATELY RIG THE GAME SO THAT THIS COULD AM WOULD HAPPEN!

YOU PEOPLE JUST PROVED WITHOUT ANY DOUBT THAT YOU FAVOR CERTAIN PLAYERS OVER OTHER PLAYERS!!

THAT IS CALL DISCRIMINATION!!!!!!

Jun 8, 2021 13:30

@Dread Stalker, while 256 (yes, it is 256 instead of 212 now) kills seem somewhat fishy for me as well, I don’t think it was obtained via cheating. I have the Elf lvl 16 and I managed to get 140 kills. Not from the first attempt for sure, but if you roll the hunt for the best start you can do it. The 256-kill run was done with the Elf lvl 20, who has Evade III and Leap Attack III skills. These skills might be crucial and change the gameplay dramatically. It is like the Knight lvl 18 who is about twice stronger than the Knight lvl 17 due to Full Swing III skill.

Jun 9, 2021 13:34

On Gas Spore hunts, the later rooms get full of gas spores, which then all blow up with one hit. I can fully believe that 256 gas spores is possible. High ranking elves are very good at evading hits and shooting from distance. There are players consistently posting 150+ hunts against a variety of different monsters. Around 200 isn’t uncommon as the hunt high score. It’s 226 mushroom men right now.

Indeed for all the heroes level 18 is the point where they all start getting level III skills which make a significant difference. And if you have amassed 10-15 million XP, you’ve probably figured out a few neat moves as well.

If you’re playing the swordsman, avoid being surrounded unless the monsters are weak. Being surrounded is the dwarf’s style! The swordsman needs the monsters one behind the other so he can skewer and cleave!
You’re right that Punt isn’t all that useful in its current form.

Jun 9, 2021 18:21

Stupid mistake. Selected Human rather than Elf by mistake. Human is absolutely useless!

Jun 9, 2021 18:55

As for the Gas Spores, they are remarkably easy to kill, and indeed help the player by exploding and killing other Gas Spores (100% of the time) and other kinds of enemies as well (but not all of the time).

So, what’s not to like?

Importantly, however, many of the larger Gas Spores are unusually effective at damaging the player, if they are given the opportunity to do so.

So don’t give them any opportunity to take a shot.

If you play the Gas Spore hunt the same way that you play every other hunt, you will lose, and likely find the experience to be very frustrating.

However, if you adopt a completely different strategy for Gas Spores (than for other kinds of hunts), taking into account their strengths and weaknesses, then hundred(s) of kills are within reach.

Hunts are fun because every kind of hunt is different, and requires coming up with its own strategic approach.

‘Nuff said?

Jun 9, 2021 19:48

@raand9999, That’s the thing, you cannot always avoid being surrounded by enemies. Sometimes, number of enemies and the battle field layout are such that there is no single tile where you are not surrounded by at least 2 enemies. Sometimes, it happens even in the dragon lair, where you cannot easily clear your way by double attack or bull rush. As a consequence of that, the knight is absolutely useless in such situations.

Jun 9, 2021 22:42

HEY MORONS!!!

WHERE IN THE HELL ARE THE MUSHROOM MEN????< IN THE DAILY HUNT!

SO FAR ALL I HAVE ENCOUNTERED ARE WEREWOLVES, ETTINS AND GHOULS!!?????

GET REAL MORONS!!!!

Jun 10, 2021 9:50

I still say the idea of you getting crappy ass +5 gear against gargoyles is stupid as donkey droppings, they start at +9 defense and go up from there, so why do we get a -4 starting gear?

Jun 10, 2021 11:38

@Earththunder, exactly! Killing a (13, 16) gargoyle from 10-th attempt is not funny at all.

Jun 10, 2021 14:01

Not sure if dread stalker is reading here (would be nice to know!), but I can promise my 256 was a fair hunt. I was just very lucky with the layout, that often gave me a “safe” spot in a crowded room of spores. My strategy was to skip the room if any spore would attack me with more than 5 in the first turn.
The mobility of the elf to get to that safe spot (good sneak success) was of course also key. I did this one good try beyond 100 and some before that had bad starts.

Jun 10, 2021 14:04

And yes, playing human against gargoyles or spores is no fun. I didn’t even get 20 today, because even the frogs were hitting me all time.
I think we should give the human a +1 bonus in the hunt… at least … poor guy…

Jun 10, 2021 14:58

Bug? I bull rushed a firebug next to two wraith lords and hit. The gas spore needler behind moved up next to them both and exploded. I don’t think the wraith lords were reduced to +3 defence until the end of the turn, after the needler exploded.

Jun 10, 2021 15:17

Bug? In a room with 2 shamblers, I hit one and it dived. The other shambler moved into its pit.

Jun 11, 2021 2:13

@Earththunder - I too think that +5 is too low for gargoyles. They are 6,9 monsters before they are enlarged. Even though they turn to stone for a bit if you hit first, that isn’t a huge help when there are several of them. They are dreadful for the swordsman because they are too big to bull rush, so full swing, press and skewer are all reduced in effectiveness. +7 is more like what you need.

@VitalyKobolov - I agree that situations where the swordsman is surrounded do occur and are not ideal. The others have different situations that are not ideal as well. It’s fair to say that the dwarf and the elf are stronger than the swordsman. I play the swordsman a lot, and I’d expect to get 30 dragons in the tournament, and 40 with a bit of luck. That is less than the 50 or 60 that the elf or dwarf usually win with.

Jun 11, 2021 3:43

@VitalyKolobkov I want to mention one more important aspect, when it gets to large games: The human might be able to handle situations 1 vs. 1, but that needs often a very special starting point in a room (like the elf may need). But the elf can sneak well and the human not. The human is also not capable of “walking through” to get the mithril. The dwarf also not, but the dwarf is still more mobile and can also hunker down if he is detected in a bad position. The human would need to be more effective without mithril (in offensive ways) to balance this somehow.

Jun 11, 2021 4:08

Bug: When killing something with a max roll and the Reaper shows up, it can move directly after the feat. I was stuck because the reaper appeared next to me and couldn’t leap away, because the feat was running and I was on adrenaline already -> no chance. I tried to feat again against the Reaper but failed.

Jun 11, 2021 4:31

I still try to sneak the mithril and the golden chest with the swordsman, but I like to have some scrolls and mid-ranking weapons in case of being spotted somewhere awkward, and I’ll give up if a room looks too difficult.

Jun 11, 2021 11:56

So, I can use some clarification on the relationship between Worms and Dwarves.

Suppose that you are playing a Dwarf that is advanced enough to summon stronger-than-usual Worms.

So, if a Worm randomly pops up, without being summoned, while playing as an advanced Dwarf, is THAT worm any different from what an Elf, a Human, or a less-advanced Dwarf would have gotten?

Additionally, it was my general impression that Worms that pop up randomly during the Hunt (while playing the Elf, for example) are sometimes weaker and sometimes stronger, presumably depending on how difficult the Hunt neighborhood is supposed to be. (If so, is there a straightforward relationship between the neighborhood-related Weapon bonus and the numerical Worm strength?)

Another related question that occurs to me. My guess is that the random Worms with stronger offense ALSO have a stronger defense, and are harder to kill than usual. Is this indeed true? If so, What is the relationship between Worm offense and Worm defense, as a function of Worm size?

And … Is the same relationship (between Worm offense and Worm defense) followed when the Worm is Enlarged by an enemy Mage?

Is the same relationship (between Worm offense and Worm defense) also followed when the Dwarf is entitled to ask for an upgraded Worm?

And (to focus again on my main puzzle) does the random Worm that appears while playing an advanced Dwarf typically conform to the design specs for a Dwarf-summoned Worm or for an Elf-randomly-encountered Worm?

It’s a puzzle. So I thought to see if I can get get some insights here, before trying to figure it out myself, by taking notes every time that a Worm shows up. Even so, it’s probably TOO LATE for me to start taking notes on what Dwarves get that are less advanced than the one that I currently have.

Cool?

Jun 11, 2021 12:03

The Worm pop up, I know it’s “supposed to be RNG” but the odds of the worm RNGing me 3 times in a row when there are enemies in all the other spots surrounding it is pretty bull crapping anti RNGing in my book.

Jun 11, 2021 14:13

OK, I have some of my experiments done, and it appears that: (1) the worm that is summoned is the same as the worm that pops up randomly (2) the result is that the “random” worm is stronger when the Dwarf is active than when the Elf is active, even within the same Tag-Team Match.

So, is that the behavior what was intended?

(3) In today’s Hunt (weapons +7) the Worm is larger than usual, apparently with both its offense and defense increasing by +2 over what they would have normally been for the Dwarf in a tag-team match.

(4) Whether the random Worm that appears for the Elf in the Hunt is weaker than the one that appears for the Dwarf …. I suspect so, but don’t have the time to figure this out right now … probably later.

Jun 11, 2021 18:01

@beetletoe, from my observations the Worm mechanics is the following. A standard worm has stats (7 ,4). A standard worm emerges randomly everywhere in Campaign, Tournament or Career mode, except for caverns and tunnels. If you play for the Dwarf, a random worm will the standard worm, not improved. If you play for the Dwarf and call the worm, it will come up improved with +2 attack (or + 4 attack if you max out your skills). The defense stat is the same – 4. Each time the worm gets buffed by a random mage, its stats are increased by two points, so a standard worm will go (7, 4) -> (9, 6) and an improved worm (9, 4) -> (11, 6). When you play the Hunt mode, a standard worm is adjusted to the level of the hunt, so that it can be (7, 4), or (11, 8) or even (6, 3) if you fight against weak monsters. If you play for the Dwarf, again, the worm’s attack stat will be improved by 2 or 4 points, only when you call for it.

Jun 11, 2021 19:19

Yes that’s it exactly. Bellow I summons a worm. Bellow II summons a grumpy worm (+2 attack). Bellow III summons an enraged worm (+4 attack). No change to defense stat.

Jun 12, 2021 1:26

Thanks, Vitaly. Thanks, raand.

So, the Worm behavior that you are both describing is the same as what I experienced, EXCEPT that I saw stronger-than-expected Worms appear, un-summoned, when the Dwarf was present.

It may be relevant, however, that most (or perhaps all–I’m not positive) of those unsolicited Worms appeared AFTER a Worm had been summoned, disappeared, and then reappeared. At least SOME of those stronger-than-expected spontaneous Worms showed up in the same room.

So I need to pay more careful attention to check the possibility that the Dwarf’s summoning event is resetting some Worm variables in the program that persist either until the room is exited, or (alternatively) for the rest of the game.

Getting reliable data on this is sometimes complicated by the tendency (while playing Dwarf) for the Worm to pop up somewhere (that has only one neighboring monster), kill the monster, and disappear again, without giving me an opportunity to hover the mouse over the Worm image, to verify its numbers.

Is there any other way that I can get that information?

Can anyone confirm my impressions about the persistence of Worm parameters after summoning?

Jun 12, 2021 19:54

I propose the following hardcore game mode: 1) a tile set on fire will destroy the loot on that particular tile. SO be careful when using flame scrolls or when dealing with fire bugs 2) Even if you kill the reaper once in the ruins, there is always a 5% chance that reaper can respawn again when killing creatures in ruins. Therefore, it is possible to have more than 1 reaper in your game. Only 1 active reaper at a time. 3) Ropers should be able to counter attack purple worms when attacked 4) the lich queen cannot have any pits next to it (to stop dwarf dirty tactics) 5) When a dragon mage summons creatures, it will not summon any monsters from caverns. It should only summon monsters from ruins or mines. 6) Extreme hardcore mode (might be to op): Dragon mages have the ability to summon lesser dragons. Example: Your quest is to slay red dragons, the dragon mage can summon white dragons. Thus killing the white dragons do not count to winning the game but can add an interesting twist to your battles. 6) Surprise attack bonus from re entries into are reduced. Instead of +3 attack melee bonus, make it +1 melee attack bonus. So in other words, door dancing tactics have been weakened because the creatures know you are going to come back eventually :) 7) Zombies can respawn if you do not clear the room or set their corpses on fire. In other words, if you kill a zombie but do not finish the room, the zombie has some % chance of resurrecting from the tile it died on (so long as no other creatures/heroes occupy the tile). 8) Maimed zombies can deal 2 damage in one melee attack if they roll a massive hit or heroic strike and the attack hits you. 9) creatures in the ruins can be oversized :) 10) Dragon lairs have anti magic rooms. therefore, if you try to active a scroll, there is a 35% chance the scroll will disintegrate and fail to activate :D 11) fireballs are less effective against dragons. Dragons get a +1 defence against fireballs. 12) when using potions, players roll a 1D6. this means, they roll a six sided die. the roll =the amount of hp restored. If you play a human or dwarf, this means you might only get 1 or 2 hp back instead of 3. Rolling 3 or above = full heal (3 hp for dwarf/human, 2 hp for elf). The reason: potions are unstable in this game, and drinking potions crafted by a stranger, thats dumped on the ground means poor quality control :) 13) Bull orc warlords can charge at you just like how the dwarf can charge at creatures. The cheating bull orc warlord is therefore more dangerous :D 14) The mummy king has a bow. Therefore, the mummy king can shoot from afar if it cannot close the distance (and not within melee range) 15) The dragon mages can summon spectre, lich queen.

To make hardcore game mode appealing, I would propose the following player advantages: 1) Limit oversized creatures in caverns. After all, placing ginormous, or titantic creatures that has stats = spectre in early game destroys the value in caverns. 2) Players start with +1 equip, but can choose to pick 1 gear and give it a small upgrade. Small upgrade = an additional +1 stat. So a player can choose to start with +2 sword & +1 shield and bow. 3) An shady scroll dealer in the mines, that lets you buy and sell scrolls. Every time you sell a flame, leap, or haste scroll you get 3 coins. To buy a flame, leap or haste scroll, you need 4 coins. Coins and scrolls do not carryover to the next game. You cannot buy invisibility or lightning scrolls. 4) Players start with extra trinkets 5) The caverns weapon chest/item racks minimum loot has +2 stat. therefore, the caverns should upgrade your non-upgraded gear. 6) Players start with more scrolls 7) adrenaline gives +3 attack + 3 defence instead. 8) have some creatures in the ruins carry a backpack. The backpack contains a random scroll. 9) offer some exp bonus for doing the hardcore game mode?

Jun 13, 2021 9:02

The randomly appearing worm should definitely not be grumpy or enraged. If you see a case of that happening, please leave an in-game feedback when it happens, and I’ll take a look.

Jun 13, 2021 11:28

Bug: I entered the room and used a leap scroll. I wanted to undo. It said “you can’t undo until you’ve completed your turn”. I moved. Then I pressed undo. It put me back at the end of the leap, not at the beginning.

Jun 17, 2021 15:11

Bug? Wormy showed up and attacked another monster. I guarded against a fireball. Everything around me got hit including wormy. Then wormy attacked me. I didn’t counterattack wormy.

Jun 17, 2021 22:03

NO WAY IN HELL DID SOME OTHER PLAYER GET OVER 100 GOBLINS, MUCH LESS EVEN HALF THAT: UNLESS THE ESTEEMED GENTLEMEN WHO CREATED AND RUN THE GAME RIGGED IT FOR THAT OR THOSE PLAYERS!!!!!

BECAUSE THOSE PLAYER MUST NEVER EVER MISS ON THERE HIT ROLLS OR SAVES!!!!!!

Jun 18, 2021 10:20

HEY YOU CHEATING MAROONS!

WHERE ARE THE SCORPIONS IN TODAY’S DAILY HUNT??????

HAVE ONLY ENCOUNTERED THREE TOTAL IN FIRST TEN LEVELS!!!!

Jun 19, 2021 8:29

NICE OF YOU PIGS ACTUALLY NOT RIGGING THE DAILY HUNT AGAINST THE PLAYER FOR A CHANGE!!!

WHAT A CONCEPT!!!! A FAIR GAME!!!!

THIS QUALIFIES AS A MIRACLE RIGHT OUT OF THE BIBLE!!!!

Jun 20, 2021 10:19

Dread Stalker sounds a bit like harvester is back :) Is anyone still reading this or are all in discord now?

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